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 #17 (permalink) Mon Jul 31, 2006 18:51 pm Is power intoxicating? |
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| Jamie (K) wrote: | | Pol Pot, Lenin, Stalin, Idi Amin, Yasser Arafat, and many others. |
you dropped very important name ..
George Boach
| Jamie (K) wrote: |
They shower affection on the person who is willing to believe the lie, and they punish or banish people who do not believe them..... |
Do you mean the same situation about Mr.Boach when he beat and destroyed one of the greatest and most important country in the middle East area " Iraq" , because " Iraq punishes or banishes people who do not believe them. " !!!! and because he wanted to publish his huge lies about the freedom in the world !!!
Boach said before war to the world that " Iraq has had a nuclear weapons , but you and I and all people have known that his talking wasn't true , and Iraq has never had any nuclear weapons .. and the " IAEA" deported all these lies.. but he insisted on ...
and now ... you should know that " the average of killing operations in Iraq is 50 people dead and above 100 hurt people every day ??? can you tell me why ???!!!!
Hey Jimai .. our God creates two eyes to everybody to see the complete image ... but I advise you when you want tell us any story .. you should use your " both two eyes " ... to tell the complete image
Herc |
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Hercules
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| #18 (permalink) Mon Jul 31, 2006 19:06 pm Is power intoxicating? |
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Michael, your view of economies as a zero sum game is part of the old pre-industrial agrarian way of viewing the world. A field would yield only a certain amout of produce, so the only way you could get richer was to steal or to plow a couple or rows into your neighbor's field, which is also stealing. That concept isn't valid anymore, and in a normal, well-governed capitalist society, nobody is poor just because someone else is rich.
Sure, people who advance economically do so by taking something from somebody else, but it's not generally through stealing. People exchange money for something they want more. That's generally a win-win situation, where each person is getting something he wants. Since the money changes hands again and again, everybody gets in on the act. When the economic activity starts to increase so much that it puts a strain on the money supply, the central bank releases more money.
I'm not stealing food from the mouths of starving children in Africa. In fact, my country gives billions in food aid to them, but if the totalitarian dictator of their country doesn't let the food get to them, that's not the fault of capitalism. |
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Jamie (K)
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| #19 (permalink) Mon Jul 31, 2006 19:39 pm Is power intoxicating? |
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| Hercules wrote: | | Jamie (K) wrote: | | Pol Pot, Lenin, Stalin, Idi Amin, Yasser Arafat, and many others. |
you dropped very important name ..
George Boach |
First off, Hercules, I have never heard of anyone named George Boach, so I can't answer any of your questions about him.
| Jamie (K) wrote: |
They shower affection on the person who is willing to believe the lie, and they punish or banish people who do not believe them..... |
| Hercules wrote: | | Do you mean the same situation about Mr.Boach when he beat and destroyed one of the greatest and most important country in the middle East area " Iraq" , because " Iraq punishes or banishes people who do not believe them. " !!!! and because he wanted to publish his huge lies about the freedom in the world !!! |
This is a very interesting situation, because almost all Iraqis I have ever talked to -- both Christian and Muslim -- WANTED the US to invade their country. They had suffered under a genocidal dictator for decades, and most recently he had killed 1.5 million of their people with poison gas. When I saw Arabs who were angry and complaining about the invasion of Iraq, they were always from other Arab countries, and almost never from Iraq. You might say those people aren't telling me their real feelings because I'm American, but I know they're speaking truthfully. But if you want to, you can go right ahead and say Arabs are liars. I just won't agree with you.
Who is this Boach guy?
| Hercules wrote: | | said before war to the world that " Iraq has had a nuclear weapons , but you and I and all people have known that his talking wasn't true , and Iraq has never had any nuclear weapons .. and the " IAEA" deported all these lies.. but he insisted on ... |
You don't read the news very much, and you don't read it very well. Iraq had both a nuclear weapons program that had not produced a bomb yet, and they had chemical weapons programs. Since the invasion, authorities have been led to parts of the program that have been buried in various places. The people who led them to the equipment do not know where all the parts are, and the people who know may already be dead, or they could be in exile. Saddam also had mobile chemical and biological weapons labs that could be moved around the country, and one or two of those have been found. In addition, he had moved from large, permanent sites to smaller, movable sites that were working on smaller weapons. For example, they were working on efficient ways to poison food produced in factories, or to fill subway stations and other places with poison gases. Hans Blix and the UN people could not find these, because since the 1990s Saddam had paid spies on the UN inspection teams. There were none of those "surprise inspections" you heard about in the news, because there were no surprises. Agents would alert the staff of the weapons facility, and they would move the equipment and materials before the inspection team got there. Now they are finding documents from Saddam's government that indicate a lot of his weapons and equipment were moved to Syria before the invasion. He had plenty of time, because the US spent half a year playing games at the United Nations. We'll know later how much he had and what was moved.
Besides, the weapons were not the only, or even the most important reason given for the invasion. Right from the beginning, the reason that was given was that Saddam's government ran training camps for terrorists who had been attacking the US and its allies. He was also financing them in various ways and giving money to the families of suicide bombers. There were plenty of good reasons to take him out, and the Iraqi people wanted him out. It seems mainly to be the Lebanese, Syrians and others who wanted the Iraqis to live under a dictator.
| Hercules wrote: | | and now ... you should know that " the average of killing operations in Iraq is 50 people dead and above 100 hurt people every day ??? can you tell me why ???!!!! |
I can't tell you why, and since Mr. al-Zarqawi is dead now, you can't ask him why either. The best you can do is look at who is doing most of the killing and listen to the reasons they give. Last I looked, most of the killing was being done by Muslim terrorists who are backed by Iran, Syria and al-Quaeda. Let's start with the time a few weeks ago when they killed the Iraqi men's tennis team. They explained why they did that: They said the men deserved to die because they were wearing shorts. They have similar explanations for the other things they do. Why do they bomb schools or kids gathering to get candy? Why do they bomb hospitals? Ask them. I guarantee you that if they stopped it, the war would be over.
| Hercules wrote: | | Hey Jimai .. our God creates two eyes to everybody to see the complete image ... but I advise you when you want tell us any story .. you should use your " both two eyes " ... to tell the complete image |
You need to read something besides the Arabic media. I read both.
But let's move on to another subject.
Have a happy day.  |
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Jamie (K)
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| #20 (permalink) Mon Jul 31, 2006 20:42 pm Is power intoxicating? |
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Jamie, you can not be serious!!! Why did you offend me that way???  I asked you about the sense i.e. the aims of capitalism and you weren?t capable an answer.
I?m not a professor of a language or something else, in particular not in economy but having a look at what happens here in Europe, particularly in Germany I only can figure out that the system the US American (although it brought some development) don?t really work. All the common richness is disappearing, since the German/Europian politicians follow the US way only and aren?t capable of having own ideas. What does that depend on? Money? Print your money and be happy!!!!!!
About your gifts to poor African children! Your armee is that powerful conquering every nation in the world. Why don?t you use it to bring the food you mentioned to that poor children? Doesn?t it make profit for the US President? Or is that possibly democratic to give it to totalitarian dictators? Why don?t you care for the correct way of distribution?
Now, all this questions come across me when I see that your representatives talk about democracy?
Michael |
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Fan Of Arabian Horses
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| #21 (permalink) Mon Jul 31, 2006 21:16 pm Is power intoxicating? |
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| Fan of Arabian horses wrote: | | Jamie, you can not be serious!!! Why did you offend me that way??? I asked you about the sense i.e. the aims of capitalism and you weren?t capable an answer. |
I wasn't trying to insult you. This zero-sum view of economics doesn't apply in modern economies. That's what I was trying to say.
| Fan of Arabian horses wrote: | | I?m not a professor of a language or something else, in particular not in economy but having a look at what happens here in Europe, particularly in Germany I only can figure out that the system the US American (although it brought some development) don?t really work. All the common richness is disappearing, since the German/Europian politicians follow the US way only and aren?t capable of having own ideas. What does that depend on? Money? Print your money and be happy!!!!!! |
If you read the business press in the US, Germany did great as long as it was following an American-style capitalist model, but since the 1950s, little by little, it has built such a huge socialist edifice, raised taxes so high, and made it so hard to start and run businesses, or even employ people, that things have broken down.
The current US and German systems don't even really resemble each other. In Germany, a third of the workers between 50 and 65 are unemployed, not because they don't want to work, not because they can't find jobs, but because the law forbids the employers to hire them. If they are so disobedient as to get a job, the government taxes them so much that it's not worth it. I got that from your own German press! It would be unthinkable in the US. And what about these Germans who are still in internships until they're 30? What about the guys who will stay home and take government money for years instead of getting temporary jobs they think are below their educational level? What about the huge government fees for starting your own business there? These are all things that slow the German economy, and we don't have them here. Germany does NOT have a US capitalist system!
| Fan of Arabian horses wrote: | | About your gifts to poor African children! Your armee is that powerful conquering every nation in the world. Why don?t you use it to bring the food you mentioned to that poor children? |
We do that. The US is the world's largest donor, although some Europeans look at phony statistics, because they think all of a country's aid comes from the government. The problem is that in some of those countries the government want the people in certain regions to starve. Remember Live Aid in the 1980s? "We are the woooooorld..." That food never got distributed. In fact, the Ethiopian government forbade it. They even sold food to Egypt for arms. Sometimes governments don't let it get distributed for other reasons, and often people in the foreign government just steal it.
Here's a question for you: With all that oil Saddam Hussein was selling, why didn't the United Nations make sure the Iraqi people got food and medicine? Why didn't the UN Oil for Food program look after the distribution?
| Fan of Arabian horses wrote: | | Doesn?t it make profit for the US President? |
To me this is a typical German question. For some reason so many people in Germany think that everything everyone does is for money in their own pocket. That's an attitude I expect from a country with the second lowest volunteerism rate in Europe.
| Fan of Arabian horses wrote: | | Or is that possibly democratic to give it to totalitarian dictators? Why don?t you care for the correct way of distribution? |
In order to assure the food is distributed properly, we would have to invade and conquer all those countries. Then you would be angry at us for that. So, no matter what is done, it's wrong. |
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Jamie (K)
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| #22 (permalink) Mon Jul 31, 2006 22:26 pm Is power intoxicating? |
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Jamie, EVERYTHING is about money!
Do you really believe every darn word the government says?
Do you really think Americans die every day over helping Irac? They die for money,for God's sake!
Why America don't give a darn about this situation in Libanon?
Man, these people first think of money, then make explanations, and you take them as reasons.
You should go to Irac, and ask the people THERE, not those ones who went to America.
It's about weapons,but not the way you think.
America have a lot of them,right?
You got to use them sometimes,don't you?
Otherwise some millioners have to go to work,don't they?
You are a tipical American: the president is the man, my country is the best.
Your president is a politic, and he thinks as a politic.
He could've said: I'll take over Irac, because I can, I ran out of oil, I got too much bullets, and this guy pisses me off anyway"
He says instead: "I really don't want to do it, because it's not nice, but he might have some weapons, at least I heard it he does, so we beter get them,before they get us, right? "
And what was he said after?
"Actually we didn't find bombs, and stuff,but I told my scouts to look more carefully next time. By the way, we stay here a bit, just in case they want to come up again with something"
He could've squeezed a sorry somewhere in his speech, but I didn't hear it.
If George is that smart, then what will the next step be?
According to your lines, they're not welcomed there, and they never will be.
It wasn't a good decision, just like the one before in Vietnam.
Anyway, we'll see it later, it's not worth to arguing over it, but let me say just one more thing.
You better try to be more open-minded, like those teachers in the movies, who saw through Nixon, and his branch.
Spencer |
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Spencer
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| #23 (permalink) Mon Jul 31, 2006 22:38 pm Is power intoxicating? |
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(With no any generalisation): Jamie, it seems to me, you idealize your country (its social order, political structure and foregn policy) a bit too much.
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Tamara
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| #24 (permalink) Mon Jul 31, 2006 23:09 pm Is power intoxicating? |
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| Jamie (K) wrote: | | I wasn't trying to insult you. This zero-sum view of economics doesn't apply in modern economies. That's what I was trying to say. |
Okay, I take that. But I don?t think about a zero-sum economy but a 100 percent-one. Imagine you have a hand of gold-powder and hand it to another person. A bit (small bit) keeps left in your hand and that is your profit. Okay, that is materialistic thought but the mass of gold-powder you hand over will become smaller. So from what shall the receiver of the gold-powder replace the original mass? Might be that I?m old-fashioned but I cannot understand how to replace the old mass. Doesn?t that fit to money?
| Jamie (K) wrote: | | If you read the business press in the US, Germany did great as long as it was following an American-style capitalist model, but since the 1950s, little by little, it has built such a huge socialist edifice, raised taxes so high, and made it so hard to start and run businesses, or even employ people, that things have broken down. |
Might be that?s similar to Germlish. It always seems like the current governments try to imitate the US-economy and fail as certainly in Europe there are different basics from the US American. Or does they fail since they weren?t capable to learn it during almost 60 years?
| Jamie (K) wrote: | | The current US and German systems don't even really resemble each other. In Germany, a third of the workers between 50 and 65 are unemployed, not because they don't want to work, not because they can't find jobs, but because the law forbids the employers to hire them. If they are so disobedient as to get a job, the government taxes them so much that it's not worth it. |
I, myself, currently work below my education for a time-job-agency and I can tell you, that there are not people between 50 and 65 only since people below 40 years lost their jobs because of staff-reducing-politics of the firms. So far you?re right that it might be caused by the law, but also by the circumstance that Europian companies don?t want to be responsible for their doing and seem to want making the fast profit only and don?t think about the future. What Is the US way of managing with responsibility?
| Jamie (K) wrote: | | I got that from your own German press! It would be unthinkable in the US. And what about these Germans who are still in internships until they're 30? What about the guys who will stay home and take government money for years instead of getting temporary jobs they think are below their educational level? |
That?s possibliy the half of the truth only. On the efforts of companies to lower the costs of employment they offer saleries below 7 Euros an hour while requesting the employees to ride a way about more than 40 kilometers partly. It?s an example of calculation to take such jobs as you have costs about 10 Euros a day. So if you work 8 hours a day you can achieve a daily salery of 56 Euros. Subtract 20 Euros for taxes and social spendings and 10 Euros for your costs of the daily way there are 26 Euros left. Having 20 labour days a month you come to an sum of 520 Euros a month if you work 160 hours a month. Then you can imagine the reason why some people don?t take such works after possibly having studied. And there isn?t any way of changing that.
| Jamie (K) wrote: | | What about the huge government fees for starting your own business there? These are all things that slow the German economy, and we don't have them here. Germany does NOT have a US capitalist system! |
Jamie, I think you read a newspaper for self-employed. Right, the German government takes fees for everything and mainly small companies are concerned. What is more bad, is that the really big companies always are able to avoid the taxes and that because they could get national support to employ people whose tasks are to find out how the company can avoid taxes and hire the staff. Can you believe that? And not even the government glamours with good example, quite the opposite.
| Jamie (K) wrote: | | Here's a question for you: With all that oil Saddam Hussein was selling, why didn't the United Nations make sure the Iraqi people got food and medicine? Why didn't the UN Oil for Food program look after the distribution? |
Right, but the war in the Iraq left a bad taste from the US behaviour, since they first attacked the Iraq, when the Iraq threatened to invade Quwait.
| Jamie (K) wrote: | | To me this is a typical German question. For some reason so many people in Germany think that everything everyone does is for money in their own pocket. That's an attitude I expect from a country with the second lowest volunteerism rate in Europe. |
That?s what you can experience every day here. Is there in your country any benefactor? I mean even that unities who sounds to be benefactors like the "Rotes Kreuz" or "Malteser-Orden" think about profit. Do you think that?s correct?
Michael |
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Fan Of Arabian Horses
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Dark Magician
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| #26 (permalink) Tue Aug 01, 2006 17:59 pm Is power intoxicating? |
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First of all , I never said that Saddam is good and we disagreed with his policy .
Secondly, I agree with what you wrote about Saddam " except the nuclear weapons part because it has never been found " , but I think it's up to Iraq people to stand up to him or not and if there couldn't do that then the UN should do that and not another country " USA" !!!
then , I need to know how and where you knew your wrong information " don't tell me from your truthless american media " ..I told you that you should use your two eyes to see the truth , but sometimes I think somebody needs to glasses to help them ...
anyway , I will help you to find the truth "even though you know every things " these links are about IAEA " I hope you know it too " and I have to tell you and help you to know its name "even though you know every things " :
The IAEA is: International Atomic Energy Agency . and you can use a big glasses or microscope to read it and hope you will understood it :
http://www.iaea.org/Publications/Magazines/Bulletin/Bull461/timeline_iraq.html
http://www.iaea.org/Publications/Magazines/Bulletin/Bull461/timeline_iraq_5.html#IAEA
http://www.iaea.org/Publications/Magazines/Bulletin/Bull461/timeline_iraq.html#limits
This is a small part of IAEA report about Iraq situation :
" The IAEA's nuclear inspection and verification experience in Iraq stretches over a span of three decades, addressing activities from the mine to the weapon. Agency inspectors led the discovery and dismantlement of Iraq's secret nuclear weapons programme in the 1990s, and after the 1990s round of inspections had stopped, they had found no evidence, up to March 2003, that the programme had been revived since 1998."
now , and after your reading the last text and the past links !!..
can you tell me why USA destroyed Iraq country ???
Thirdly, I don't imagine someone lives in this world can accept foreign country to invade his country and make decision on his behalf " even you don't accept another country to interfere in your democracy and your dignity ...and.....and.." !!!!  
Fourthly, every country has its experience of freedom and democracy " So there are types of democracy " and I don't think any country should inforce its experience on others " .
Fifthly, I believe we should stand up against all weapons you have wrote about without discrimination ...
So, USA , Russia , Israel  ................ don't have the Right to obtain any of those And fight who tries to benefit from nuclear energy ...
sixthly, I never heard your shorts story , However you shouldn't connect Islam to terror ,cause the Islam order us not to kill civilians and there are some groups who want to deface this merciful religion " you should have know better "..!!
Hey Jamie , I hope you again to use your " both two eyes " ... and that when you want to tell anybody the complete image and tell us the true story ..
now.. let's move on to another subject
Good afternoon Jamie .. what's the roads like ?...
they're so slippery... I know that
so be careful .. my friend 
Have a fantastic day
Herc |
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Hercules
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Hercules
I'm here quite often ;-)
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Posts: 339
Location: Syria
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| #28 (permalink) Wed Aug 02, 2006 18:45 pm Is power intoxicating? |
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Hi,
Jamie has unfortunately( !!!!!! ) right.
Please remember about the true !
Arab world is very different and very
hard to understand even for themselves.
Egypt was already very hard beaten by Israel Army and now they have peace if You want to have peace here you need to win again the war. Losers do not want to share any humiliating peace they want to have time to start killing again.
No justice , no peace
Jan |
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Jan
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