'To take a toll ON smb', 'to take a toll OF smth'?

[Tamara]

Hi

My freshest trouble with prepositions:

’It took (a) physical toll on him.’

take a toll on
...take its cost, affecting/influencing (badly), or something like that…
And whatever I think about 'take on' in this case, it's the standard use.
OK.

toll of:
‘The mental toll of revolution…’
‘…the toll of death and injury on Scotland's roads.’


I’m aware of the death toll and ‘bridge tool’ meanings of toll. Having checked three dictionaries.
And I understand the case-difference in 'toll of... on’ in the above phrases.

I just don't have 'a rule'.
And don’t know, what preposition would be correct, for example, in:

‘rent takes a heavy toll (…of? on? from? …) his income.’
?
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[Yankee]

Hi Tamara

In this case, one of the "rules" is the combination (collocation) of 'take' and 'a toll'. Saying 'take a toll on (something)' is a standard combination.

Saying 'the toll of' is like saying 'the cost of'. The preposition 'of' is used to tell you what produced or caused the toll/cost or what sort of a toll it is.

The preposition 'on' is used to indicate who/what suffered the toll (i.e. who/what had to pay 'the price')

Amy

[Tamara]

Aha... Thanks, Amy.

The only tiny problem is to decide whether 'his income' from my question sentence suffers (in the above sense). Or not.
Perhaps, not... at least, in English. 'He' is who will have to pay.

The second rule ('produced or caused') isn't applicable directly... 'a toll of rent', yes...
Hmm.

So, I'll just use 'rent takes a heavy toll of his income.'
And let's see what will happen.
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[Yankee]

*sigh*

The rent takes a heavy toll on his income! (This is the first rule I mentioned.)

His income suffers because of the high rent. In other words:

- The high rent causes his income to be used up quickly.
- The high rent is the reason that little of his income is left each month.
- The toll of the high rent is that his income is used up quickly.
- The rent acts on the income and produces a costly effect (costly effect = toll).

Does that clarify things any, Tamara?

Amy

[Tamara]

(Aaaa-a-a-a-a…. (bitterly crying )
Could anybody recommend to me a language-without-prepositions to learn?)

It seems, now I've caught my trouble.

As I understand, 'to take a toll' can be (also) used in the meaning 'to inflict losses' or something like that. ?
Not to be abstract… let’s take the (very last ) example – and hopefully I’ll accept your rules.

take a heavy toll of the enemy
or
take a heavy toll on the enemy
?

The first use is the temptation I couldn’t resist
Why can't we say that ('toll of the enemy')?
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[Yankee]

http://sara.natcorp.ox.ac.uk/cgi-bin/saraWeb?qy=take+a+toll+of

Hi Tamara

take a toll on

You need a whole sentence so that the cause of the suffering or loss is clear:

The battle took a heavy toll on the enemy. = The enemy suffered losses which were caused by the battle. = The battle (and the opposing army) inflicted losses on the enemy.

Use 'take a toll on (someone/something)' when toll means 'loss, damage, suffering, etc., resulting from some action or calamity'

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

take a toll of

The word 'of' could possibly be used to describe how much/what size the toll was. For example:

The battle took a toll of huge dimensions. (the loss/damage/suffering/etc. was huge)

Amy

[Alan]

Hi Tamara,

If you're feeling prepositionphobic, how about this bit of logic? A toll is a tax you have to pay. So instead of saying: It'll take a toll on his health, why not: It's taxing his health?
Bingo!

A
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[Tamara]

[Alan]

Hi Tamara,

Phrasal verbs are a bit of a gimmick in all honesty. They provide loads of stuff for EFL teachers to rabbit on about but they are only poor substitutes for the genuine article. I'm sure Bill Shakespeare would have agreed with me.

A
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[Prezbucky]

yeah

Could the same meaning be derived from these two sentences?

- This job is really taking a toll on me.

- This job is really tiring.

"Taking a toll on..." may mean many things:

- I'm tired
- I'm angry
- I'm annoyed

etc.

By using the exact verb, we have the ability to avoid ambiguity.

...maybe (waiting for Alan's hammer to fall. hehe)
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[Alan]

Good thinking, Cheesehead.

A
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[Prezbucky]

I'd better change my profile... turns out I no longer want to be known as a Cheesehead. hehe
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[Bara]

Yes guys I totally agree with you. Phrasal Verbs is a bit of a gimmick in all honesty and I need to add that we as EFL when we see/hear phrasal verbs have to think about it clearly and do not ever think in complex way as most of EFL mess up these verbs and don't concentrate on the context to get the right meanning . I wish I was led to correctness.

[Tamara]

Hi

Last year one of my tutors told us that when she had been to India, she was forced not to use phrasal verbs at all - to be understood by people who normally speak in English rather 'conserved' at the level it was in XIX. They just transfer that state of Engish across the generations (and through official school) - and don't understand latest 'gimmicks'.
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[Yankee]

.
I guess Alan's use of 'Cheesehead' took a toll on Tom.
But, now I'm curious about why prezbucky decided on Raskolnikov as a replacement.