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#2 (permalink) Fri Nov 17, 2006 5:57 am Prevent sb. from sth |
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| Adding from after the second "her" would make the sentence sound a lot better. |
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Canadian45 I'm here quite often ;-)
Joined: 08 Oct 2006 Posts: 184 Location: Canada
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#3 (permalink) Fri Nov 17, 2006 6:02 am Prevent sb. from sth |
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Hi, thanks again. But how about the second quote question? I need its answer badly.
haihao |
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Haihao I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 26 Oct 2006 Posts: 1392 Location: Japan
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#4 (permalink) Fri Nov 17, 2006 6:05 am Prevent sb. from sth |
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Both "patted" clauses are correct and are equally good. "himself" should be left out! |
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Canadian45 I'm here quite often ;-)
Joined: 08 Oct 2006 Posts: 184 Location: Canada
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#5 (permalink) Fri Nov 17, 2006 6:18 am Prevent sb. from sth |
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A million thanks again. Just one more question, may I?
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| God grant that the Corsican monster who is destroying the peace of Europe may be overthrown by the angel whom it has pleased the Almighty, in His goodness, to give us as sovereign! -- War And Peace |
What does the 'it' refer to in '...whom it has...'?
haihao |
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Haihao I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 26 Oct 2006 Posts: 1392 Location: Japan
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#6 (permalink) Fri Nov 17, 2006 22:37 pm Prevent sb. from sth |
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HaiHao ... The 'It' refers to the specific situation created by God (the Almighty). That is to say... God was pleased to make the Corsican Monster the Sovereign; It (making the Corsican king) pleased God.
As an aside, the use of 'pleased' in this context means 'satisfied' rather than suffused with pleasure. |
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Pond969 You can meet me at english-test.net
Joined: 17 Nov 2006 Posts: 99 Location: Canada
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#7 (permalink) Fri Nov 17, 2006 23:42 pm Prevent sb. from sth |
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Hi, Pond969,
Thank you for the tip. I am getting closer to it now but I still can't take hold of the word 'whom' then. Could you please give me one more hint?
haihao |
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Haihao I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 26 Oct 2006 Posts: 1392 Location: Japan
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#8 (permalink) Sat Nov 18, 2006 5:23 am Prevent sb. from sth |
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Hi, again. I'm a kind of not very clear about:
1. pat her shoulder 100%= pat her on her shoulder because there should be some difference or I'm just overthinking? 2. prevent her from understanding = much better. But why? 3. himself = left out! 100% satisfied!
haihao |
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Haihao I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 26 Oct 2006 Posts: 1392 Location: Japan
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#9 (permalink) Sat Nov 18, 2006 7:03 am Prevent sb. from sth |
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You don't need to say "pat her on her shoulder". You cannot pat her on someone else's shoulder!
"prevent someone from doing something" is just the correct wording.
"prevent someone doing something..."is a different grammatical construction. Her fear would prevent her understanding of her father's explanations from actually helping her. |
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Canadian45 I'm here quite often ;-)
Joined: 08 Oct 2006 Posts: 184 Location: Canada
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#10 (permalink) Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:37 am Prevent sb. from sth |
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Hi, Uncle Canadian,
Nice to hear from you again. I think I have got your point. But just one more thing I want to make clear that it seems to me there is also another grammatical construction in English as you say: she hit me on my face, he beat me on my side, ... no end of them. It's hard for me to think it's no need to put them this way because we can say: she hit my face, he beat my side... instead. To me, 'she hit me on my face' seems putting an emphasis on 'hit me' while 'hit my face' no such emphasis but I am not sure if this is a correct catch.
haihao |
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Haihao I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 26 Oct 2006 Posts: 1392 Location: Japan
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#11 (permalink) Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:50 am Prevent sb. from sth |
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Hi Haihao
I would say 'prevent someone doing something' (without the word from) is a British usage. A search of the BNC for 'prevent her' turned up plenty of examples of the 'prevent someone doing something' construction: http://sara.natcorp.ox.ac.uk/cgi-bin/saraWeb?qy=prevent+her
In North America, the prepostion from would be used in this construction.
Using the possessive adjective my instead of the in a sentence such as 'Jane hit me on the arm' is not necessary unless it would be unclear for some reason whose arm Jane hit. Saying 'on the arm' simply gives a more exact location of a hit that we already know is 'on me'.
Amy |
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Yankee I'm a Communicator ;-)

Joined: 16 Apr 2006 Posts: 8265 Location: USA
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#12 (permalink) Sat Nov 18, 2006 13:42 pm Prevent sb. from sth |
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Hi Amy,
Thank you for everything. I am satisfied with it now.
haihao |
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Haihao I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 26 Oct 2006 Posts: 1392 Location: Japan
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#13 (permalink) Sun Nov 19, 2006 17:10 pm Prevent sb. from sth |
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| Haihao... I am not surprised you are having difficulty... this is a particularly unwieldy and clunky sentence. In fact ... and apologies here .... after looking at it again I think I may have misinterpreted it and steered you off course .... On closer reading, it would seem that the writer is asking that God cause the Corsican Monster (presumably Napoleon?) to be deposed by the angel that he has been pleased to raise as sovereign.... the 'whom' would refer to the angel. In English, the word 'whom' generally follow a preposition ('to whom', 'by whom' etc.) so I rather suspect the word 'who' should have been used here. |
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Pond969 You can meet me at english-test.net
Joined: 17 Nov 2006 Posts: 99 Location: Canada
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#14 (permalink) Sun Nov 19, 2006 17:27 pm Different interpretation |
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| Pond969 wrote: |
| The 'It' refers to the specific situation created by God (the Almighty). That is to say... God was pleased to make the Corsican Monster the Sovereign; It (making the Corsican king) pleased God. |
I strongly beg to disagree on your interpretation, Pond. Maybe you didn't read the sentence very carefully. The angel here refers to the Russian Tsar Alexander I. 'Whom it has pleased the Almighty to give us as sovereign' means 'whom God saw fit to give us as a ruler'. |
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Conchita Language Coach

Joined: 26 Dec 2005 Posts: 2826 Location: Madrid, Spain
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#15 (permalink) Sun Nov 19, 2006 17:32 pm Oops! |
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| Sorry, Pond, I hadn't seen your last post. Well, let's hope things are a bit clearer for Haihao now. |
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Conchita Language Coach

Joined: 26 Dec 2005 Posts: 2826 Location: Madrid, Spain
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| Meaning of "reference to" | Comparing or Compared? |