Announcement (Today I asked a female Tibetan who was selling handcrafts, she...)

[Aleaf]

Why?
Why?
Why do you think the usa established its military bases in japan ,korea and so many asian country?Why do you think USA performs Joint military exercises with the countries around china?

some countries treat china as a treat to them 'cause of the different social system as well as differnet ideology.

By the way Dala lama won't succeed forever. Tibet is a part of china now, so whether Tibet to be independent or not will be decided by all Chinese instead of only by Tibetans. The same case in Taiwan.

I know Dala lama has a big market overseas, but why don't you foreigners consider the feelings of the chinese people in other parts of china?
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[Rosalisa]

[Aleaf]

China has nuclear weapons, hasn't it? And why do those countries feel threatened by China?
Please may I ask you some questions:"Who was the first one that owned nuclear weapons in the world?" If those countries didn't do it first, why should we put so much money and energy in it?
Who is the most powerful country in the world with the strongest millitary? Is that China?

He just wants to bring peace and stability in Tibet and if the Chinese government make him sure that the conditions in Tibet improve there's nothing else important.
That was just what he hoped you could believe.Okay if it is true i think it is high time for him to stop,because condition there is improving.

Have Tibetans expressed their feelings as much as Chinese have?

They are chinese.Just like other nationalities in china, we are all chinese.Chines not only= Han nationality.Chinese are composed of 56 nationalities.
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[NinaZara]

Hi aleaf,

I do not think Chinese have to be a citizen of China to be Chinese. There are a lot of Malaysian Chinese in Malaysia. They acknowledge that China is the motherland (of all Chinese) but they love being a Malaysian. It's who they are. The same thing goes for the Taiwanese and the Tibetans. I do not know much about the Tibetans but Taiwanese hate Chinese who think like you. I do not think they hate you, but they hate it that you think they owe it to you to come back "home" to China.

Do you not think that it is possible for a Chinese not wanting to be a Chinese or being in China?

The closest example I witnessed was my grandmother, she is Chinese and my great grandmother was from China. But guess what, she doesn't even remember that. One time we were talking on the dinner table and she said "Why are you kids sounding like the Chinese? Have some manners!" (I know it was a racist statement. In the Malay culture talking or discussing things while having the dinner is improper) We kids laughed because she doesn't remember she's Chinese! I was an impertinent, mouthy child back then, and I talked back, "You're being ridiculous, you ARE Chinese!" She put chillies in my mouth. Scary grandmother or what?

Another example is a Chinese(Malaysian) guy I got to know briefly a month ago I met at my workplace. He speaks English all the time, but he is Chinese so I assumed he knows how to read the Chinese characters. So when I stumbled upon a character I wasn't sure of the meaning I asked him. I do not think you'd like what he said.

He said " What do you take me for? Do you think I know that shit?"

I could not believe my ears. Apparently I was insulting him for asking whether or not he knows how to read the chinese character. It turns out to be he's a Malaysian Chinese who spent most of his life in the UK.

Another shocking one(at least to me) is recently I found out a MALAY warrior by the name Hang Tuah was a CHINESE! Hang Tuah is a legend and a great "Malay" warrior. The most loyal warrior to the Sultan and has sacrificed his life for him. One of his famous saying is "Takkan Melayu hilang di dunia" literally "Malays shall never perish from this world" meaning Malays will always leave great history. I have known him since kindergarten. And suddenly at the age of 25, I learnt that he was a Chinese? I still could not believe it. Believe me, 99% of Malaysians will not believe this.

So you see,it is not just the DNA that makes you a Chinese or an Indian or any race for that matter, but the environment, the culture and the people that surround you. Hang Tuah has proven to the world that he is Malay, body and soul (despitre his DNA that says otherwise).

So, will you ever find it in your heart and just let go?

Nina

[Torsten]

Hi Aleaf,

I'm sure you will be able to come up with an appropriate title for your discussion? You might want to read this:
What is a meaningful message title and why is it important?
http://www.english-test.net/forum/ftopic16459.html

Please let us know if you need a hand -- we can suggest some ideas.
Regards,
Torsten
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Test Of English for International Communication
TOEIC Preparation & TOEIC Vocabulary

[Aleaf]

Do you not think that it is possible for a Chinese not wanting to be a Chinese or being in China?

I don't care about those who don't want to be a chinese. If they don't want to be chinese any more, they can leaf for any places in the world, but the place of Taiwan is an individable part of chinese territory forever. But as long as i know. not every person in Taiwan don't want to be a chinese.any some of them believe Taiwan is a part of china. What they don't hope is that china is under control of Chinese communist party. If one day the political dispute is resolved, Taiwan is sure to return to mainland.

One time we were talking on the dinner table and she said "Why are you kids sounding like the Chinese? Have some manners!" (I know it was a racist statement. In the Malay culture talking or discussing things while having the dinner is improper) We kids laughed because she doesn't remember she's Chinese! I was an impertinent, mouthy child back then, and I talked back, "You're being ridiculous, you ARE Chinese!" She put chillies in my mouth. Scary grandmother or what?

She was not a chinese. in china we call this kind of persons "banana".Yellow skin but thoughts of white people this kind of prson are chinese only in the eyes of foreigners. But in chinese opinions they are not chinese.
BTW not every chinese like talking while eating especially as chinese saying goes:"食不言，寝不语。“is a Chinese etiquette literally means one shouldn't talk while eating or sleeping.From the story you mentioned above i guess your grandmother didn't know china very well or at least what he knew china was very limited and one-side. Of course i don't deny that many chinese behave improper.

So, will you ever find it in your heart and just let go?

yeah they can go absolutely but go without taking away the place.

Those chinese overseas no matter they like or not, no matter they accept chinese culture or not, and no matter they are proud of china or not, they are chinese in their blood. China is a country having magnificant history but having shortcomings as well. If a chinese forgets his/her origin, i just feel pity about him/her. Because it is just like a kid who doesn't know his/her real parents.

aleaf
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[Aleaf]

No Mr. Torsten
thanks anyway.
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Try to change youself before you try to change others.

[NinaZara]

[Aleaf]

If we follow your logic, we would have to disperse all countries like Malaysia, Indonesia, Brunei and Singapore and form a new Malay country. Which is impossible because there are not just Malays or a cluster of the Malay races(Dayaks, Kadazans, Bajaus, Javanese, Bugis and hundreds more) in those countries,there are also the Chinese and the Indians to consider.

I don't think the case in these countries is the same as in Taiwan. The countries you mentioned above were Independent countries, No matter how many chinese in these countries, they won't be parts of china. But Tiwan is a part of china.
A child resists its parents but he/she is living in his/her parents' house. In order to live in peace i think two ways to resolve the situation will be acceptable.
1. parents and the kid settle the problem by compromise
2. the kid leaves the house. anyway it is impossible for the kid to bring his/her room away.(my opinion.)
In the issue of taiwan and Tibetan, we won't give up in the aspect of territory forever.

The only way I see why you fail to see this is because you are a communist.

I am not a communist.(but maybe i am a communist in my blood. After all i grow up in a communism country.) I just explained it in a chinese point of view. As a chinese i don't hope my country lost any territory. And i won't accept the territory of my country seperates into many parts just because of some stupid dfferent point of view in politics. I don't hope hundreds of years later, when my offsprings talk about this history, they feel heartached and criticize us.

Of course you care, if you don't, you won't be calling them "bananas".

Believe it or not I don't care because it is her choice.I won't care any chinese whether they want to be a chinese or not. As long as i know i am a chinese, it will be enough.I f i had been born overseas, i wouldn't have been a real chinese.

And I don't think you can call her a "banana". She's yellow, but chocolate on the inside. Chocobanana, then?

funny. hehehehe

So now you're saying my grandmama is a Chinese no matter what? .
No matter she likes being a chinese or not.
And define "real". A biological parent doesn't necessarily make a "real" parent. In this case China doesn't necessarily make a "real" parent to Taiwan.

A biological parent doesn't necessarily make a "real" parent

i agree but if this happens , won't you feel sad for it?
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[Aleaf]

Many chinese overseas don't realize that they are chinese because they don't have chinese thoughts.But at the same time they won't change their chinese genes. It is very contradicted. They are regarded as a chinese overseas, but they are regarded as a foreigner in china. Who the hell are they ?

BTW when i say the above i don't have any bias i just feel it is a very interesting phenomena.And i don't think there is anything wrong or bad.
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[NinaZara]

[Aleaf]

I was telling you that with your logic, these countries should be disbanded and the Malays should reform the Malay world again.

what have i said led you to draw such a conclusion?I feel confused. What is my logic?

You're being very stubborn about this territory thing, tell me, if you were to give the Taiwanese an ultimatum, what would it be?

You are absolutely right and i will be stubborn about it forever. And most chinese are even more sturbborn than me. Here is no bargain.
ultimatum? don't be so serious. I don't think it is high time to give an ultimatum.

And try to be out of the box for a change and see that we can share the same culture without belonging to the same country.

Sure we can share the same culture without belonging to the same country, but here again Taiwan is a part of china.

So you're saying, the Chinese government should change, eventually? Of course I understand that it should be done gradually.

no here i mean any decision made must be based on long-term.Maybe if Taiwan is independent nowdays, some taiwanese will feel glad, but hundreds of years later when people review the history those who made such a stupid decisionwill be criticised badly. Those people will be regared as guilty persons forever by chinese offsprings.
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Try to change youself before you try to change others.

[Aleaf]

History can't be revised but people are history. we decide what will our present history be. Don't make the history that make people feel heartache many years later.
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Try to change youself before you try to change others.