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 #17 (permalink) Sun May 25, 2008 17:20 pm I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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1.
"I myself, I reckon that..."
There should be a comma there, and "I myself" simply emphasizes the second "I". The emphasis was probably added because someone else had a different opinion or other people had different opinions. (i.e. contrast)
2.
| Nessie wrote: |
| I've heard the use of "result" here is American English. Is it true? |
No, it is possible to say 'no result' in both BE and AmE. It simply refers to the outcome (result) of something as a whole rather than as multiple or various individual things.
The word 'result' is countable. You originally used 'no results' in your sentence. As Haihao said, that usage is fine.
Which of the following are you taught to say?
- There is no flower in my garden./There isn't any flower in my garden.
- There are no flowers in my garden./There aren't any flowers in my garden.
I hope the second pair of sentences sound more common to you.
Here is my challenge for you, Nessie:
The first pair of sentences are not incorrect in AmE or in BE, however they would be far less commonly used than the second pair. Why do you think someone might use one of the sentences in the first pair?
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Yankee
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| #18 (permalink) Sun May 25, 2008 17:27 pm I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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| Quote: |
| I still don't understand the structure "I myself I...", Molly. Is it used commonly in standard English? |
I doubt it, but who knows?
| Quote: |
| 2/ As for the matter of "results" vs "result": I just want to ask why we can't use "result". |
Who said you can't? |
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Molly
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| #19 (permalink) Mon May 26, 2008 0:19 am I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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| nessie wrote: |
Hi Molly,
I somehow find that discourse marker so strange. I made a search in the BNC and found no results for "I myself, I think"
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Hello Nessie,
I would find it strange too, in ordinary written BrE. But in spoken BrE, "I myself I reckon" might indicate e.g. a false start:
1. I myself — I reckon that...
where the speaker begins to say e.g. "I myself think that", but pauses and starts again with a new phrase.
All the best,
MrP |
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MrPedantic
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| #20 (permalink) Mon May 26, 2008 7:31 am I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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| Quote: |
| I would find it strange too, in ordinary written BrE. But in spoken BrE, "I myself I reckon" might indicate e.g. a false start: |
Would you say the same for these examples?
Me, I reckon that...
Personally, I reckon that...
I..., I reckon that... |
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Molly
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| #21 (permalink) Tue May 27, 2008 21:43 pm I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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1. Me, I reckon that...
— "me" is sometimes used as an emphatic pronoun in this way. Thus not strange.
2. Personally, I reckon that...
— "Personally" qualifies the following sentence(s). Thus not strange.
3. I, I reckon that...
— "I" tends not to be used as an emphatic pronoun in this way. Thus strange.
4. I myself I reckon she'll go back to London, because she's got absolutely nothing left to give here.
— "I myself" tends not to be used before "I" in this way. Thus strange. Lose one "I" and it becomes "not strange".
5. myself, I think that if any thing happens to Keith which is obviously he's not gonna live a long life if any thing happens to him I, I myself I reckon she'll go back to London, because she's got absolutely nothing here she's got a cousin although, I don't think she'd move in, in with her cousin
— the full version from the BNC. Natural incoherence + several pints of lager.
MrP |
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MrPedantic
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| #22 (permalink) Tue May 27, 2008 22:42 pm I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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| Quote: |
2. Personally, I reckon that...
— "Personally" qualifies the following sentence(s). Thus not strange. |
As maybe does "I" in "I myself, I reckon that" (Sometimes heard as "I, I reckon that").
| Quote: |
3. I, I reckon that...
— "I" tends not to be used as an emphatic pronoun in this way. Thus strange.
4. I myself I reckon she'll go back to London, because she's got absolutely nothing left to give here.
— "I myself" tends not to be used before "I" in this way. Thus strange. Lose one "I" and it becomes "not strange". |
But saying "strange" doesn't give us any real idea of why it does occur. You said earlier that it could be an example of a "false start", but I just don't see where you're getting that from.
Would you say it's an example of a false start here?
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I myself, I have just started learning about money. I did not really know what equity was, or what an asset is, or why you depreciate things, or what a balance sheet is, or a cash flow statement. I knew almost nothing. Now I know a tiny amount. But my goal is to learn enough about money so I can use it as a tool to be flexible in life.
http://www.salon.com/mwt/col/tenn/2008/04/29/money_differences/ |
Aren't "false starts" rather rare in written English?
......
And is this "false start" down Ms Jelinek, or to her translator?
Final word from Walt:
WHEN I read the book, the biography famous,
And is this, then, (said I,) what the author calls a man’s life?
And so will some one, when I am dead and gone, write my life?
(As if any man really knew aught of my life;
Why, even I myself, I often think, know little or nothing of my real life;
Only a few hints—a few diffused, faint clues and indirections,
I seek, for my own use, to trace out here.) |
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Molly
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| #23 (permalink) Tue May 27, 2008 23:07 pm I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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Interesting synonyms?
OK, so I for one I'm excited about Kevin being in the show.
OK, so I myself I'm excited about Kevin being in the show.
OK, so I personally I'm excited about Kevin being in the show. |
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Molly
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| #24 (permalink) Wed May 28, 2008 0:25 am I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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Walt's is a different case:
1. Why, even I myself (I often think) know little or nothing of my real life
Cf.
2. I myself (I reckon) she'll go back to London, because she's got absolutely nothing left to give here.
Doesn't work.
MrP |
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MrPedantic
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| #25 (permalink) Wed May 28, 2008 7:11 am I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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| MrPedantic wrote: |
Walt's is a different case:
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And the others? Can you point out the false starts in them? |
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Molly
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| #26 (permalink) Thu May 29, 2008 0:14 am I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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Elfriede's is a different case. "I myself" is part of an attempt to render her particular style:
1. Was immer geschieht, nur die Sprache geht von mir weg, ich selbst, ich bleibe weg. Die Sprache geht. Ich bleibe, aber weg. Nicht auf dem Weg. Und mir bleibt die Sprache weg.
MrP |
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MrPedantic
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| #27 (permalink) Thu May 29, 2008 1:43 am I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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| Quote: |
| Was immer geschieht, nur die Sprache geht von mir weg, ich selbst, ich bleibe weg. Die Sprache geht. Ich bleibe, aber weg. Nicht auf dem Weg. Und mir bleibt die Sprache weg. |
Wow, what a difference between the English translation and the original!
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Yankee
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| #28 (permalink) Thu May 29, 2008 7:16 am I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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| Quote: |
1.
"I myself, I reckon that..."
There should be a comma there, and "I myself" simply emphasizes the second "I". The emphasis was probably added because someone else had a different opinion or other people had different opinions. (i.e. contrast) |
The comma is probably needed in the written form, but do you feel there would always be a pause after "myself" in spoken usage? |
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Molly
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| #29 (permalink) Thu May 29, 2008 7:39 am I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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| Quote: |
| Elfriede's is a different case. "I myself" is part of an attempt to render her particular style: |
I doubt it. Do you think it's a style particular to her?
"Du schweigst? du seufzest? Ach! zu wohl nur, gute Amme,
Versteh' ich was dein Schweigen mir verhehlt!
Du hoffest nichts für meine Flamme!
Ich selbst, ich hoffe nur weil beßrer Trost mir fehlt."
From Oberon by Christoph Martin Wieland.
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Titus.
Wir leben aber in der Welt des Scheins!
Mariamne.
Das seh ich jetzt, drum gehe ich hinaus!
Titus.
Ich selbst, ich habe gegen dich gezeugt!
Mariamne.
Damit du's tätest, lud ich dich zum Fest!
From Herodes und Mariamne by Christian Friedrich Hebbel
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Hon grät modiga tårar
på sin första rynkas andra dag
men jag själv,
jag känner förnyelse banka skrämmande slag
i mitt bröst
........
Och jag själv, jag ska väl bli gammal någon gång, men när bestämmer jag, inte du. Ständigt nyfiken. Nya saker händer som jag inte trodde kunde hända, sådant som helt enkelt saknades på menyn och därför inte kunde väljas.
http://hem.bredband.net/wifsve/ |
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Molly
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| #30 (permalink) Thu May 29, 2008 14:00 pm I myself am + adjective or noun? |
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Still having a little trouble finding the delete button, old chap? Maybe Slava could make it look like a big old Metal button so that it will be easier for you to find.
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Yankee
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| Use of "ravel". | Toss vs Throw |
Nessie
... something we never have again, I know... I guess I really really know..