| Need advice on improving writing style | a verse from "Born in the USA" |
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 #16 (permalink) Wed Jun 11, 2008 22:24 pm Is this sentence ok? (Read aloud the following dialogue...) |
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Hello Nessie,
I'm not sure the rule for "in doing so" can be extended to other verbs; usually, "in doing so" is only used to refer back to an earlier action, e.g.
1. He reached for the marmalade, and in doing so [i.e. "in reaching thus"] knocked over the mug of coffee.
So:
2. In making the cakes, I put salt instead of sugar into the flour ] better to say "while".
3. In buying the clothes at the mall, she came across him. ] no; "while".
4. Don't talk in eating! ] no; "while" again (or more probably, "when you're eating", "with your mouth full").
5. On arriving at the airport, I remembered I had left my purse at home ] fine!
6. Sarah, on finishing that report, come to see me right away ] "on + -ing" is less common in speech; more likely, "when you've finished..."
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| P.S: Is the use of "judge" in my sentence right or wrong? |
(Not quite right! "A judge" is a person, not an act of judgement.)
Best wishes,
MrP |
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MrPedantic
I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Southern England
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| #17 (permalink) Wed Jun 11, 2008 23:36 pm Is this sentence ok? (Read aloud the following dialogue...) |
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| Quote: |
I'm not sure the rule for "in doing so" can be extended to other verbs; usually, "in doing so" is only used to refer back to an earlier action, e.g.
1. He reached for the marmalade, and in doing so [i.e. "in reaching thus"] knocked over the mug of coffee. |
How about:
The girl may have thought she was being an independent modern woman of some sort, partners with her boyfriend rather than a purring feline standing under the awning. And in thinking so she may have been partially correct.
http://www.idsnews.com/news/story.aspx?id=51007&comview=1
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"I think he wants much more, but in wanting so he comes across as a bit bolshy."
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Molly
I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 12 Feb 2008
Posts: 4017
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| #18 (permalink) Thu Jun 12, 2008 8:35 am Is this sentence ok? (Read aloud the following dialogue...) |
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Hello Nessie,
I'm not sure the rule for "in doing so" can be extended to other verbs; usually, "in doing so" is only used to refer back to an earlier action, e.g. |
:roll: :roll:
| Quote: |
1. He reached for the marmalade, and in doing so [i.e. "in reaching thus"] knocked over the mug of coffee.
So:
2. In making the cakes, I put salt instead of sugar into the flour ] better to say "while".
3. In buying the clothes at the mall, she came across him. ] no; "while".
4. Don't talk in eating! ] no; "while" again (or more probably, "when you're eating", "with your mouth full").
5. On arriving at the airport, I remembered I had left my purse at home ] fine!
6. Sarah, on finishing that report, come to see me right away ] "on + -ing" is less common in speech; more likely, "when you've finished..." |
Let's have a look at my original sentence (with Molly's idea):
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| "Read aloud the following dialogue, and (in doing so (,)) pay attention to the sound /tr/ and /dr/." |
I think this refers to "while" rather than "an earlier action"...
| Quote: |
| Quote: |
| P.S: Is the use of "judge" in my sentence right or wrong? |
(Not quite right! "A judge" is a person, not an act of judgement.)
Best wishes,
MrP |
So what about this, MrP? "Please judge them"?
Thank you very much
Nessie
_________________
:(... something we never have again, I know... I guess I really really know.. :(
Sorry seems to be the hardest word... |
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 Nessie
I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 16 Feb 2008
Posts: 1102
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| #19 (permalink) Thu Jun 12, 2008 18:24 pm Is this sentence ok? (Read aloud the following dialogue...) |
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| nessie wrote: |
I think this refers to "while" rather than "an earlier action"...
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Sorry, it was a little unclear! I meant an action "earlier" in the text...
"Please judge them" is fine, grammatically, but might sound overly formal in a forum context. (I'm not sure I can think of an alternative with "judge"; but "check" would be fine.)
All the best,
MrP |
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MrPedantic
I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Southern England
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| #20 (permalink) Sat Jun 14, 2008 17:58 pm Is this sentence ok? (Read aloud the following dialogue...) |
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Hi MrP,
I think I understand what you meant about the earlier action in the text. I'm just still unclear about the use of "in doing so" and "in + V_ing"...
_________________
:(... something we never have again, I know... I guess I really really know.. :(
Sorry seems to be the hardest word... |
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Nessie
I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 16 Feb 2008
Posts: 1102
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| #21 (permalink) Sat Jun 14, 2008 21:59 pm Is this sentence ok? (Read aloud the following dialogue...) |
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Hello Nessie,
| nessie wrote: |
I think I understand what you meant about the earlier action in the text. I'm just still unclear about the use of "in doing so" and "in + V_ing"...
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I think the point to remember is that "in doing so" has a special function; "in V-ing", on the other hand, can have a number of different functions. Thus:
1. He reached for the mug and [in doing so] knocked over the sugar.
— Here, "in doing" stands in place of the earlier verb, and "so" in place of the prepositional phrase. "In doing so" therefore connects the earlier action with its consequence:
1a. He reached for the mug and [in the act of reaching | for the mug] knocked over the milk.
I should correct my earlier comments at this point: "in" here is not an exact equivalent of "while", since "while doing so" does not necessarily imply that the two acts are connected:
2. He reached for the mug and while doing so knocked over the milk.
— "while doing so" only implies that the "reaching" and "knocking over" were concurrent; not that one caused the other.
The structure in #1 can also be distinguished from an initial "in + V-ing" phrase, e.g.
3. In opening his present before his birthday, he had committed a serious mistake.
— i.e. "[by the act of] opening his present..."
(There may be initial "in + V-ing" phrases that do not have the sense of "by the act of"; but none spring to mind at the moment. Perhaps someone else will think of one.)
Then too there are "in + V-ing" phrases which relate to completely different structures, e.g. set phrases:
4. We have made significant progress in reducing crime.
— i.e. "progress in [the project of] reducing"; "progress in V-ing" is a set phrase.
5. We have succeeded in finding the culprit.
— i.e. "succeeded in [the project of] finding"; "succeed in V-ing" is a set phrase.
Does that help at all? Let me know if not...
Best wishes,
MrP |
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MrPedantic
I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Southern England
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| #22 (permalink) Mon Jun 16, 2008 8:06 am Is this sentence ok? (Read aloud the following dialogue...) |
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Thanks a lot, MrP,
It's a bit clearer now, but I think I haven't fully understood the matter. However, as Jamie said, I need to be patient and read more so as to see more and know more about native English using style...
_________________
:(... something we never have again, I know... I guess I really really know.. :(
Sorry seems to be the hardest word... |
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Nessie
I'm a Communicator ;-)
Joined: 16 Feb 2008
Posts: 1102
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| Need advice on improving writing style | a verse from "Born in the USA" |
