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Standard spoken English: What is it?


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Standard spoken English: What is it? #16 (permalink) Sun Jun 15, 2008 4:52 am   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Actually Haihao, 'lah' is a Malay exclamation. It's very similar to 'yo' in Japanese. My guess is, this kind of language is created because the Chinese wanted to assimilate with the Malays when they speak to us. It also happened to the standard Malay language which is the official language of Malaysia. All full sentences are simplified and spoken with the Chinese intonation/accent. I think some expressions are very hard to understand unless you have the chance to listen to Malaysians speak them. We Malays understand it fine and we use it when we speak English with Malaysian Chinese. Among Malays we speak our own dialects but it pretty much depends on the family background. If the parents were educated overseas (English spoken country, usually England or Australia), it is most likely the children converse in English in their everyday lives. It also depends on the schools they attend.
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #17 (permalink) Sun Jun 15, 2008 5:27 am   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

I see. Thank you, Nina. BTW, what does your Nagano life look like, lah? :D
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #18 (permalink) Sun Jun 15, 2008 5:39 am   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Quote:
I see. Thank you, Nina. BTW, what does your Nagano life look like, lah? :D


Let me rephrase that.

I see. Thank you-orr Nina. BTW, how is your Nagano life, ah?

So so, I'd say. :wink:
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #19 (permalink) Sun Jun 15, 2008 5:49 am   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Good-orr! BTW, maybe 'yasashii nikoniko Papa ha mo~tto suki!' or 'nikoniko shiteiru yasashii Papa ha mo~tto suki!' would be better. :)
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #20 (permalink) Sun Jun 15, 2008 6:00 am   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Why do you prefer 'nikoniko' as a verb and not an adverb in that sentence? I can't see the difference. :oops:
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #21 (permalink) Sun Jun 15, 2008 7:19 am   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

I don't know myself, Nina. :) It just tingles on me that 'nikoniko papa' is more kawaii a papa and I am not sure myself if nikoniko could act as an adverb here.
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #22 (permalink) Sun Jun 15, 2008 13:11 pm   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Haihao wrote:
I don't know myself, Nina. :) It just tingles on me that 'nikoniko papa' is more kawaii a papa and I am not sure myself if nikoniko could act as an adverb here.


There I thought it was just a beaming 'papa' :lol: . I mean, my father is nice, but I'm not sure he can pass as "more kawaii a papa", he wears turban and all. I'm not sure about nikoniko as an adverb too. Maybe the difference is between spoken and written expression.

Have a pleasant evening,
Nina
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #23 (permalink) Sat Jun 21, 2008 15:12 pm   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Molly wrote:
I'm intrigued by Mr P's mention of the term "standard spoken English". He hasn't yet given a clear definition of what he means by that term,


I think I said "standard spoken British English".

If I learn language X from a book, I expect the accompanying CDs to contain dialogues in a consistent form of X that is free from dialect words, regional grammatical forms, rural accents, comical mispronunciations, etc. (Unless of course they're flagged as such.)

It will probably be a form of X that is close to that used by newsreaders, radio announcers, etc.; if I learn to speak it well, native speakers of X will understand me easily, no matter what kind of X they speak themselves; and it will give me the best chance of understanding a wide range of different forms of X.

What I don't want, when I first learn X, is to pick up an inadvertent and incongruous rag-bag of regional pronunciations, accents, local grammar, dialect words, obscure slang, controversial usages, idioms from different forms of X, etc. Ideally, when I speak X, it should not draw attention to itself, or distract the addressee.

Replace X in the above with "British English", and you have my meaning.

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Standard spoken English: What is it? #24 (permalink) Sat Jun 21, 2008 15:25 pm   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

I share your views, MrP. I always ask myself how students who are part of a 1 year university exchange programme in Ireland get away with a more or less unclouded use of English. They are mostly aware of the tasty morsels of Irish English, but communicate in a way that would be universally understood.

Is there a type of 'language holiday' you'd recommend to eager learners suffering from time famine?
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #25 (permalink) Sat Jun 21, 2008 23:11 pm   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Ralf wrote:
Is there a type of 'language holiday' you'd recommend to eager learners suffering from time famine?


I think that may be beyond my area of pontification – I haven't ever been on one of those. (Though lengthy visits to overseas offices can serve much the same purpose, now I come to think of it.)

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Standard spoken English: What is it? #26 (permalink) Sat Jun 21, 2008 23:24 pm   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Quote:
I think I said "standard spoken British English".


From your description above, it sounds like you mean "spoken standard British English" (what I in the past have called "spoken-written English"). IMO, that's not the same as "standard spoken British English" (i.e. spoken-spoken English).
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #27 (permalink) Sat Jun 21, 2008 23:26 pm   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Quote:
They are mostly aware of the tasty morsels of Irish English, but communicate in a way that would be universally understood.


Where does the model for their spoken exchanges come from? What is the source? If one needed to learn what Mr P calls "standard spoken British English", which materials, etc. would he/she use, or refer to?
Molly
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #28 (permalink) Sat Jun 21, 2008 23:35 pm   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Molly wrote:
Quote:
I think I said "standard spoken British English".


From your description above, it sounds like you mean "spoken standard British English" (what I in the past have called "spoken-written English"). IMO, that not the same as "standard spoken British English" (i.e. spoken-spoken English).


I'm not sure the distinction is useful.

If the spoken version can be described as "spoken written English", then the written version can equally be described as "written spoken English".

MrP
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #29 (permalink) Sat Jun 21, 2008 23:42 pm   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

Quote:
If I learn language X from a book, I expect the accompanying CDs to contain dialogues in a consistent form of X that is free from dialect words, regional grammatical forms, rural accents,


So, no speakers of standard English have rural accents, right?
Molly
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Standard spoken English: What is it? #30 (permalink) Sat Jun 21, 2008 23:47 pm   Standard spoken English: What is it?
 

I'm not sure the distinction is useful.

It is to those who don't wish to obscure things and who wish, when speaking, not to be bombarded with prescriptive grammar rules that are based on the standard written form. If you want to base your spoken English on the standard written form, feel free, but please don't tell us that it is "standard spoken English". It isn't.
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