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 #2 (permalink) Wed Jun 03, 2009 14:44 pm Sentence: I wondered that the porpoises had not long since gone away. |
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Both sentences are hopelessly awkward, poorly formed and confusing, and both should be abandoned.
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 Mister Micawber
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| #3 (permalink) Wed Jun 03, 2009 15:46 pm Sentence: I wondered that the porpoises had not long since gone away. |
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| Hi, Mister Micawber, could you give a correct one please? What I really care is the real meaning of the quotation at the top. As for those two sentences, I just tried to express two possible meanings of it. |
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Iwanna
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| #4 (permalink) Wed Jun 03, 2009 21:36 pm Sentence: I wondered that the porpoises had not long since gone away. |
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Hi,teachers. Maybe this question was complicated by myself. I just don't get the exact meaning of that quotation. More specifically, I just don't know the meaning of 'long since' in such contexts (coming together with negative perfect tense). Please just tell me what the following sentence means:
The porpoises have not long since gone away.
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Iwanna
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| #5 (permalink) Wed Jun 03, 2009 21:49 pm Sentence: I wondered that the porpoises had not long since gone away. |
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| It was not so long ago that the porpoises left. |
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SkiIucK
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| #6 (permalink) Wed Jun 03, 2009 22:32 pm Sentence: I wondered that the porpoises had not long since gone away. |
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| Iwanna wrote: |
| I wondered that the porpoises had not long since gone away. |
Hello Iwanna,
I agree with Mister Micawber that (1) and (2) are not good.
The following rewording reflects the way I would understand your sentence as a stand-alone sentence (i.e without any additional context):
I was amazed that the porpoises were still there. All things considered, it would not have been at all surprising if the porpoises had gone away a long time ago.
The broader context could possibly have an impact on my interpretation, but I really don't expect it to. The sentence tells me that the surprise was not simply that the porpoises didn't leave, but that they didn't leave a long time ago.
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The expression "long since" is used to reference a point in the (relatively) distant past -- i.e. similar to "a long time ago".
- I have long since forgotten his name. = I can't remember his name. I forgot his name a long time ago. / It has been a long time since I could remember his name.
- I had long since forgotten his name. = I couldn't remember his name. I had forgotten his name a long time before.
Here is an example with the same sort of negative format as your original sentence:
- I hadn't seen him in 50 years, and he was astounded that I hadn't long since forgotten his name. = He was astounded that I remembered his name (when I saw him). He would not have been surprised if I had forgotten his name ages ago.
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Esl_Expert
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| #7 (permalink) Thu Jun 04, 2009 14:32 pm Sentence: I wondered that the porpoises had not long since gone away. |
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| Thank you very much for your wonderful explanation, Esl_Expert. And thank you to SkiIucK too. |
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Iwanna
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| #8 (permalink) Mon Dec 07, 2009 2:25 am Sentence: I wondered that the porpoises had not long since gone away. |
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| Iwanna wrote: |
I wondered that the porpoises had not long since gone away.
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The verb "wonder" taking a that-clause means something like "marvel" or "be pleasantly amazed", in contrast to the use with an embedded question (I winder if he's here, I wonder who he talked to"), which basically means "want to know".
What your original sentence means is this:
I was amazed/I marvelled/was pleasantly surprised that [the porpoises did not leave a long time ago.]
I gather from the comments above that there is some disagreement on the meaning, and implicatures, of the bracketed clause. To me, it *means* just this" "it is not the case that the porpoises left a long time ago".
But it carries an implicature that the porpoises are *still here*. (And it's not just a specific group of porpoises; the two choices are "here there are still porpoises", and "here there are no more porpoises any more".)
-- Andy Barss |
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Andybarss
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| the usage of more | What is a difference between "at the point and on the point of? |
