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 #2 (permalink) Sat Aug 08, 2009 6:34 am Why "the Ukraine" is with the article? |
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I found this at Wkipedia:
Ukraine versus the Ukraine
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| In English, the country was formerly usually referred to with the definite article, that is, the Ukraine (as in the Netherlands, the Gambia, the Bronx, the Congo, and sometimes the Sudan), and sometimes still is. However, usage without the article is now more frequent,[6] and has become established in journalism and diplomacy since the country's independence (for example, within the style guides of The Economist [1], The Guardian [2] and The Times [3]). The use of the definite article is standard in German (die Ukraine), although this is generally required for all non-neuter place names. |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Ukraine |
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 Expatcat
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| #3 (permalink) Sat Aug 08, 2009 6:38 am Why "the Ukraine" is with the article? |
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An observation about this sentence in the Wiki-quote above:
"In English, the country was formerly usually referred to..."
The words "formerly usually" together sound incorrect to me. Can any of our grammarians let us know if this is acceptable? |
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Expatcat
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| #4 (permalink) Sat Aug 08, 2009 7:19 am Why "the Ukraine" is with the article? |
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Thank you Expactcat,
Still one more question: Why did "the Ukraine" and "the Hague" remain "the Ukraine" and "the Hague" but the "France', for example, become France?
As for "formely usually"- it sounds strange to me too.
By the way, have a nice weekend.
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Yuri Yurinov
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| #5 (permalink) Sat Aug 08, 2009 8:04 am Why "the Ukraine" is with the article? |
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I think you may have misunderstood the wiki-quote to mean that ALL countries used to be referred to with an article. But the above quote is only referring to "Ukraine".
As for "The Hague", I think the reason we use the article is because we have translated it literally from the Dutch, Den Haag. |
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Expatcat
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| #6 (permalink) Sat Aug 15, 2009 14:34 pm Why "the Ukraine" is with the article? |
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| It is very interesting item. I don't know whether there are any scientific researches in the world but I know some unpopular hypoteses. First, if a name of a country or city has the definite article (THE) it means that it may be a common noun in origin. The Ukraine meant "The Border" in old Russian (medieval). Then in 19th and 20th centuries the Ukrainian people who contended for their independence from Austro-Hungary and Russia began to consider that meaning offensive. The matter is the meaning of the word "Oukraina" has changed to "remote area". When the country became independent in 1991, the definite article was cancelled for reasons of policy. Please compare to the Scottish Borders. This is an analogue of "the Ukraine" in Scotland. Formerly there were a lot of "ukraines" in Russia. These facts were recorded in Russian chronicles. Another example is the Netherlands that means "low lying lands". You will laugh but the first word sounds like Ukrainian or Russian "Neez" that means "bottom"... |
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